Lieberman & Lieberman: Together at Last
Fresh from trying, and failing, to convince American Jews that Sarah Palin and John Hagee should be our guiding lights, Joe Lieberman’s decided to hop across the pond for a photo op with Yisrael Beitenu leader Avigdor Lieberman, who seems to be auditioning for the role of Foreign Minister. Who’s Lieberman? I still don’t think there’s any better way to make the point than to quote Martin Peretz who deems him a “certified bigot and and apparent crook”. Or, in an earlier post “the Israeli equivalent of Jorg Haider of Austria (now dead) and Jean-Marie LePen . . . no better than Haider and no worse, except that he is a Jew which makes him more repulsive . . . team of non-entities . . . Arab-baiting.”
Obviously, given those kind of sentiments from even very hawkish and anti-Arab American Jews, sensible Israelis are going to wonder about the possible impact of the Liebermanification of their national security posture on U.S. public opinion. And rightly so. But here’s Joe Lieberman going out of his way to pre-empt those fears. And why? Coalition negotiations are ongoing in Israel. There’s some debate as to whether or not the U.S. ought to intervene behind the scenes to try to nudge things in a more centrist direction. I can see the arguments on both sides of that, but why on earth would a U.S. politician intervene to nudge things in a less centrist direction? It’s ludicrous.
32 Responses to “Lieberman & Lieberman: Together at Last”
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February 23rd, 2009 at 9:27 am
Did Avigdor offer Joe a pork chop?
February 23rd, 2009 at 9:33 am
By all means, let the US be associated in the Arab mind as smiling, unquestioning friends of a nation that makes free-fire zones out of civilian areas. Pictures like this, Lieberman being the former VP candidate after all, just hurt the US in the Muslim world.
February 23rd, 2009 at 9:37 am
Did any US politicians ever do a photo-op with Haider?
February 23rd, 2009 at 9:39 am
Wild. Israeli politics (and the interaction of the American Jewish community) is anything but uninteresting.
Here’s what Matt wrote after Rabbi Yoffie of the URJ wrote an op-ed in anguished support of the Gaza war.
Now here’s Rabbi Yoffie last week:
It is pretty tough finding just the right amount of Jewish nationalism to support, I guess.
February 23rd, 2009 at 9:43 am
Avigdor (Yvet) Lieberman’s positions are abhorrent, but he’s actually not that different from Peretz, or Holy Joe. As Jeffrey Goldberg noticed recently on his blog, he lines up with Judeo-hawks on a lot of issuers.
Yvet is in favour of dismantling some settlements, keeping other, and keeping Jerusalem. He is, like most American Jews, in favour of civil marriage in Israel and against the subsidies to Haredis. And he really hates Arabs.
The biggest policy difference is his view on Arab-Israelis — he wants to cede certain Arab Israeli towns and villages to Palestine, and strip citizenship rights of all arab-Israelis who refuse to swear allegience to a Jewish state of Israel.
How long before Peretz, Joe Leiberman, Krauthammer and others start demaning loyalty oaths for Arab-Israelis? I give it 2 months.
February 23rd, 2009 at 9:49 am
Holy Joe needs to lineup work after thsi term since his chances are somewhere between zero and none right now. He glummed into McCain for a possible job. Now he’s looking into other ventures!
February 23rd, 2009 at 9:58 am
Lieberman the Israeli is a Russian Jew. Many, perhaps most, Russians don’t like Jews or even hate them. Anti-semitism there is very strong. But the one thing that Russian Jews and “ethnic Russians” can agree on is that they hate Muslims even more, whether they are Arab, Caucasian, or Central Asian. The disgusting vile racism against Muslims is strong in Russians and super strong in many Russian Jews, in part because it’s a way to help show that they are “really” Jewish, despite their love of pork products and the fact that many are atheists or even Christians.
February 23rd, 2009 at 9:59 am
So why did Al Gore choose Joe Lieberman to be his vice-President in 2000?
Why are Democrats still blaming Ralph Nader for causing Al Gore to lose the 2000 election?
February 23rd, 2009 at 10:04 am
I mean, President Gore could have died –from choking on a chicken bone most likely — and President Joe Lieberman would have had control of the US nuclear arsenal.
February 23rd, 2009 at 10:07 am
Joe should be deported to Israel, since he seems to love it more than he loves this country.
February 23rd, 2009 at 10:08 am
Re Don Williams
Why are Democrats still blaming Ralph Nader for causing Al Gore to lose the 2000 election?
Because fucking goatfucker Nader attracted enough votes from assholes like Mr. Williams in New Hampshire and Florida to cause those two states to go for Bush. But, I suppose, that Mr. Williams still proclaims that there was no difference between Bush and Gore.
February 23rd, 2009 at 10:13 am
“So why did Al Gore choose Joe Lieberman to be his vice-President in 2000?”
My guess would be because Florida was the closest big state at the time he made the decision, and he figured there was a good chance the election would rest on Florida, so a Jew would help balance the ticket. I’m pretty sure that was the correct calculation; another VP might well have done better in states he was already ahead in but a bit worse in Florida. And Lieberman wasn’t really disliked at the time, except among gamers.
February 23rd, 2009 at 10:27 am
I’m increasingly convinced that Joe Lieberman just doesn’t have a clue what the hell he’s doing, ever, outside of a very vague sense that he wants to be a “non-Democrat Democrat” or whatever it is he fancies himself.
That is, he knows that he likes to do things that annoy other Democrats in order to paint himself as an independent. But if you asked him to explain why he wanted to meet A. Liberman, he wouldn’t have a good answer for you, or even a coherent answer, because he simply doesn’t know himself.
I think he saw it as a good chance to look hawkish with the extra cleverness of meeting someone with the same last name, but he didn’t think about the ramifications beyond that.
February 23rd, 2009 at 11:00 am
I’m surprised that the two of them meeting didn’t stretch the Lieberman Tolerance of the universe beyond breaking point, opening a hole int he fabric of reality through which Elder Things man should not wot of poured through out of the recesses of our collective nightmares. Or maybe they did, and no one noticed.
Speaking of the loyalty oaths business, one of the most terrifying signs of that particular idea’s impending acceptance was a post, I want to say on TNR, that compared it to the Pledge of Allegiance in the U.S. It really was astounding. No, it’s really not, it’s more like if only the Muslim kids had to recite the pledge, and everyone who didn’t got their whole family deported.
February 23rd, 2009 at 11:06 am
StevenAtwell wrote
it’s more like if only the Muslim kids had to recite the pledge, and everyone who didn’t got their whole family deported/i>
Actually — no. It’s like Navajo having to swear allegiegance to an oath that designates the US a “white man’s nation” if they want the right to vote. I’m sure Leiberman’s oath won’t be selective.
Anyway, link to the TNR post if you can. I’d like to see how fast Yvet’s ideas spread among American pundits.
February 23rd, 2009 at 11:06 am
Shit, Italics.
February 23rd, 2009 at 11:08 am
“no better than Haider and no worse”. Nonsense, A. Lieberman is vastly worse than Haider, indeed as is Netanyahu. You would be much better to take your usual line that TNR is white-washing Israeli extremism, as is there wont, than accept the “no better than Haider and no worse” claim at face value. Just because they admit AL is extreme doesn’t mean that they accept just how extreme AL is.
February 23rd, 2009 at 11:09 am
Because Middle Eastern affairs and counter-terrorism policy paid a microscopic role in the 2000 election and the political discourse in America in the years before 9/11.
February 23rd, 2009 at 11:25 am
Re SLC’s comment “But, I suppose, that Mr. Williams still proclaims that there was no difference between Bush and Gore.”
————-
Of course there was a big difference. But between President Bush and a President Lieberman? Not so much.
February 23rd, 2009 at 11:30 am
I can no longer recall the other names Gore was kicking around. But I do remember watching Holy Joe debate Cheney and thinking how much more impressive Cheney was. Little did I know at the time…
February 23rd, 2009 at 11:46 am
John Kerry and John Edwards were the other names on Gore’s short list.
Man, Cheney was good in debates, wasn’t he? The way he spoke, he just came across as so reasonable.
February 23rd, 2009 at 2:27 pm
Hitler, Stalin, or Mao would’ve been preferable to Tarjuffe. He would’ve nuked Iran, Syria, Pakistan, and Saudi Arabia. And, the MSM would’ve been petrified to criticize him.
As far as Gore 2000 – with Lieberman as the #2 they lost EVERY Southern State including Arkansas, and W. Virginia. In the VP debate – Cheney didn’t seem like that bad a guy in contrast to the constipated whine of Joey. Why did Gore pick him? He’s just not a bright man.
February 23rd, 2009 at 3:19 pm
Re otto
To Mr. otto, every potential Israeli Prime Minister is Hitler because they all stubbornly refuse to agree that the Government of israel should go out of business.
February 23rd, 2009 at 3:28 pm
SLC, The Third Reich wanted to last 1,000 years. That’s a justification for a racist Jewish genocidal policy? Ted Bundy stubbornly refused to stop raping and murdering pretty auburn-haired coeds with their hair parted in the middle. Most pedophiles stubbornly refuse to stop molesting children. It’s interesting whom Israel is taking its cues from.
February 23rd, 2009 at 4:55 pm
He picked Lieberman because one of the biggest “issues” in the 2000 election was Bill Clinton’s penis, and Joe Lieberman had (at that time) assumed the position as one of the most boring, moralistic, paternalistic Democrats in the country. The Democratic Party in 2000 seemed to be betting that refusing to discuss possibly the most economically successful Administrations since World War II, and replacing that discussion with sheer prudishness would sweep them into office.
It didn’t work. D’oh.
February 23rd, 2009 at 5:20 pm
Choosing Joe Lieberman because you want people to stop thinking “dick” strikes me as a pretty bad idea.
February 23rd, 2009 at 5:28 pm
Three words: President Joe Lieberman.
Al Gore. What were you thinking? At least Sarah Palin is hot.
February 23rd, 2009 at 6:49 pm
joe from Lowell Says: “Choosing Joe Lieberman because you want people to stop thinking “dick” strikes me as a pretty bad idea.”
Oh sure, like everybody can’t see that now. Nevertheless, you were the first to ring in, so you get the win, and retain control of the board
February 23rd, 2009 at 7:34 pm
I think in all seriousness, that Joe L. should use the right of return and become an Israeli citizen. Don’t you bet he’d be happier as a Yisrael Beitenu Knesset member? He could pitch that to the Connecticut voters. “What other senator ’sits on the board’ of another country?” or… “Joe Lieberman knows how to speak arabic.”
February 24th, 2009 at 12:14 am
“I’m surprised that the two of them meeting didn’t stretch the Lieberman Tolerance of the universe beyond breaking point, opening a hole int he fabric of reality through which Elder Things man should not wot of poured through out of the recesses of our collective nightmares. Or maybe they did, and no one noticed.”
They did – you’re looking at them in the picture.
Fucktard Joe Lieberman is the “Senator from Israel” – let’s just make it official so no one has any doubts about things like this.
February 24th, 2009 at 9:34 am
Attached is a link to todays’ column by Richard Cohen who apparently doesn’t like Avigdor Lieberman any better then does Mr. Yglesias.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/02/23/AR2009022302291.html?hpid%3Dopinionsbox1&sub=AR
March 9th, 2009 at 8:17 pm
This was a poorly-considered quote because it can easily be spun into an accusation of anti-Semitism. The context is important and was insufficiently given in the post you linked to. Haider was a neo-Nazi. For a Jewish politician to hold literally fascist political views is sickening, given how greatly Jews have sufferred at the hands of such ideology.