Dec 30th, 2008 at 3:27 pm
Question of the Day
Spencer Ackerman asks the tough questions:
Is comparing Bush to Sarah Palin more insulting to Bush or to Palin?
I’m going to say “more insulting to Palin.” Palin’s something of a laughingstock, but Bush is a villain. I mean, he wrecked the world economy, he led to millions of Iraqis being forced to flee their homes, he’s a total disaster and a disgrace. Palin gave bad answers in TV interviews. There’s no real comparison.
49 Responses to “Question of the Day”
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December 30th, 2008 at 3:28 pm
he wrecked the world economy
Yikes. That seems like an excessively strong claim.
December 30th, 2008 at 3:30 pm
given the chance, i think Palin could be worse.
December 30th, 2008 at 3:33 pm
And he traded Sammy Sosa. With Palin’s sports journalism knowledge, she certainly could have avoided that.
The good news is that Palin will now never get that chance.
December 30th, 2008 at 3:39 pm
Yes, much more insulting to Palin. It boils down to Torture President vs. Clueless Losing VP Candidate.
December 30th, 2008 at 3:40 pm
I don’t know, I think cleek is right. Palin’s answers in those interviews suggested a level of stupidity way deeper than George W. Bush’s. Watch Bush talk off-the-cuff and he comes across as someone who may not have a real sophisticated understanding of public policy issues, but at least he’s familiar with the basics, he’s heard this stuff before, and he’s capable of talking about it a little. I know, maybe that’s because he’s had more experience than Palin, but we don’t really know if Palin would learn anything. Bush didn’t seem to learn much in 8 years.
Also, “George Bush wrecked the world economy” is indeed a bit of an excessive claim.
December 30th, 2008 at 3:42 pm
On second thought, you’re right. Palin has shown that she’s dumb and unserious, but she hasn’t shown herself to be evil in the same way that Dubya has.
December 30th, 2008 at 3:45 pm
Palin had a lot of potential. Bush, on the other hand, actually screwed up everything he touched up to the last day. What other President can claim a world economic crisis and a new war in Palestine on his watch, just in his last 6 months in office?
Mostly, insulting one by comparing him to the other is a just reward for their shared unfitness for any public office.
December 30th, 2008 at 3:47 pm
Although it seems comparing someone to Palin has already become a common insult against potential officials - see C. Kennedy.
So in my opinion it was meant by Wilkerson as an insult to Bush.
December 30th, 2008 at 3:53 pm
I agree with those that say that Palin would be just if bad if not worse if she were given the chance. To date, she’s only had the opportunity to make a fool of herself on the campaign trail. Can you imagine her as president of the United States?
December 30th, 2008 at 3:53 pm
Palin has shown that she’s dumb and unserious, but she hasn’t shown herself to be evil in the same way that Dubya has.
Only due to lack of opportunity. If Alaska had an army or intelligence service you’d better believe somebody would be getting tortured.
December 30th, 2008 at 3:55 pm
They’re both poster children for the GOP appeal to “the common man”. Palin is a bit of an escalation in the anti-intellectual, anti-government meme. Which candidate would you want to have a beer with, degenerated into with which candidate would you want to father a child or swap recipes.
December 30th, 2008 at 3:58 pm
Only due to lack of opportunity. If Alaska had an army or intelligence service you’d better believe somebody would be getting tortured.
True. There is that shooting wolves from airplanes policy. Afterall, most serial killers start out on animals as well.
December 30th, 2008 at 3:59 pm
Wilkerson’s larger point is to cast Bush as a cipher, with Cheney filling the “personality vacuum, character vacuum, details vacuum, experience vacuum.” He doesn’t grant Bush that much agency, which I think is a bit of a let-off.
December 30th, 2008 at 4:01 pm
And you base this upon what? The way she bankrupted her town when she was mayor? The way drug use their skyrocketed while she was in charge? If a person drives a town of 8,000 into the ground, I think their well of managerial potential is pretty dry.
December 30th, 2008 at 4:03 pm
How about we compare them both to Rod Blagojevich?
Or even Plaxico Burress…
December 30th, 2008 at 4:03 pm
Palin has shown that she’s dumb and unserious, but she hasn’t shown herself to be evil in the same way that Dubya has.
I can buy that.
The decision not to torture is based on a capacity to see the humanity in your enemy (the foundaiton of the golden rule), and an awareness that one cannot be certain of one’s moral or factual rightness (an intellectual and moral humility).
Has Sarah Palin done anything to demonstrate any of those traits?
December 30th, 2008 at 4:05 pm
Can’t we all just agree that they’re both fuckin’ idiots?
December 30th, 2008 at 4:06 pm
And you base this upon what?
A lot of potential for screwing up, of course.
Although to be fair, I was quite impressed by her resume the first time I heard of her, when she was nominated. Of course after a couple of days it was obvious she was unfit for office. Too bad for McCain that he didn’t spend that much time vetting her!
December 30th, 2008 at 4:23 pm
It’s pretty insulting to both of them, really. Bush has been one of the most powerful and important people in the world, while Palin isn’t really anything. But conversely Bush has abused his massive power, well, massively, while Palin hasn’t had the opportunity.
Wait! This belittles us both!!
December 30th, 2008 at 4:30 pm
Don’t you need criminal intent in order to be a villain?
I think Bush lacks insight into his actions (otherwise he’d be horrified).
Cheney, on the other hand, knows exactly what he’s doing, and is okay with the suffering he causes.
December 30th, 2008 at 4:32 pm
Ooh, this is a tough one.
If you were forced to choose between George W. Bush or Sarah Palin being president for the next four years, which one would you pick? I think I’m actually inclined to say Palin. She is every bit as ignorant as Bush, probably more so, but she doesn’t seem to have the kind of Messiah complex that IMO made Dubya truly dangerous.
December 30th, 2008 at 4:34 pm
Given her arrogance, vengefulness, and ignorance, I firmly believe Palin has the ability to screw over America even more than Bush. She just hasn’t had the opportunity. Bush seems to lack any passion whatsoever about what he does or doesn’t do. People died, markets crashed, rights were trampled, problems were ignored, solutions were delayed, people and institutions were corrupted and Bush just didn’t care. Others (reporting to Rove and Cheney) did the dirty work while Bush preened or played or hid. Gov. Palin creeps me out with her enthusiasm for corruption and back-stabbing.
December 30th, 2008 at 4:37 pm
No, joe, Palin hasn’t demonstrated any of those traits. But I prefer to give people the benefit of the doubt as to whether they would order someone to be tortured. Maybe that makes be naive, but unless someone has actively shown themself to be evil, I wouldn’t assume they would order a prisoner to be water-boarded.
Palin is way, way dumber than Bush, so on the stupid-but-not-evil decisions, like the inability to foresee what would happen in Iraq despite everyone who knew anything telling you what to expect, Palin might well have been worse than Dubya.
December 30th, 2008 at 4:48 pm
Also, “George Bush wrecked the world economy” is indeed a bit of an excessive claim.
It’s a stretch, but not too far of one. He had his hand on the brake handle, and refused to pull. Just look at the record of his SEC, OTS, and OCC to see how he intentionally aided and abetted the thieves and idiots on Wall Street.
His administration knew what was happening but they continued to grease the skids, probably hoping that it would all blow up on the next guy instead of them.
December 30th, 2008 at 4:56 pm
She is every bit as ignorant as Bush, probably more so, but she doesn’t seem to have the kind of Messiah complex that IMO made Dubya truly dangerous.
Maybe you should view Pastor Muthee blessing Sarah Palin, asking Jesus to “make a way for Sarah, even in the political arena.”
Here’s another beaut by her Pastor.
I think religiously speaking, Palin is actually farther out to lunch than Bush.
December 30th, 2008 at 4:58 pm
Palin: Made it to governor on her own merits, became VP nominee due to tokenism.
Bush: Became governor and President because of nepotism.
It’s an insult to Palin because she actually had to work to get political power.
December 30th, 2008 at 5:34 pm
Potential is just another way of saying “haven’t done it yet”. Palin is potentially a worse president than Bush.
December 30th, 2008 at 6:13 pm
I think it reflects worst on the Republicans. Bush and Palin are two of a kind.
December 30th, 2008 at 6:31 pm
Palin’s a villain too, just a lesser one. Denying rape kits to Wasilla’s rape victims was a villainous thing to do.
December 30th, 2008 at 8:26 pm
This is liberal blogging at its best (and of course, I’m being completely sarcastic when I write that).
December 30th, 2008 at 9:03 pm
Bush is a presumptive war criminal, Palin is not.
December 30th, 2008 at 10:28 pm
Watch Bush talk off-the-cuff and he comes across as someone who may not have a real sophisticated understanding of public policy issues, but at least he’s familiar with the basics, he’s heard this stuff before, and he’s capable of talking about it a little.
Yes, but George Bush has been President of the United States for eight fucking years.
One would hope that by now he’d be familiar with the goddam basics.
Talk about the soft bigotry of low expectations…
December 30th, 2008 at 10:48 pm
Both are door-knobs. Their like a water puddle in August when faceing actual probing questions. Their brains dry-up and their weak minds take over; forcing them to verbaly spill loops of nonsense for answers.
“BANNED Pres. Bush Interview”:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fze2J2Ve9is
“Complete Gibberish: Even Katie Couric is appalled by total ignorance of Palin”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mKakxNRxe6g&feature=related
December 31st, 2008 at 12:08 am
Matt said, “he wrecked the world economy, he led to millions of Iraqis being forced to flee their homes”
Uh…Matt? Aren’t you forgetting something? Like maybe the up to a million DEAD IRAQIS?
Weird oversight that is, Matt. Truly fucking weird. Its like saying Hitler is a villain because he started a war, hurt the world economy, and stole the Jews’ possessions.
December 31st, 2008 at 3:24 am
Are those hickies on Sarah Palin’s neck?
December 31st, 2008 at 3:32 am
Wrong frame.
Did the RNC expose the US to more potential harm by nominating GWB as candidate for president or by nominating Palin as VP?
Palin is by far the more dangerous pick, even as VP.
You can’t compare things which are not of the same class. Anyone who was paying attention knew that GWB would be a figurehead president, I mean, the head of his VP search team chose himself as VP. Was any more evidence needed?
But Palin is more easily compared with Britney Spears. Talent galore, but total lack of experience and knowledge in important subject areas (like teenage sex) or the unfounded hope that “what was captured on video yesterday will remain captured and never replayed.”
Palin would have been a disaster beyond measure. She could not serve as an honest broker for her president. Does she understand enough details to negotiate Canadian annexation of New York State? Probably not. So she might think it is worth trading for more Copper River Salmon. She is simply too stupid to trust. But the RNC didn’t care.
Maybe stop focusing on the Republican candidates as individuals, the party promotes them as their representative. Hold the party responsible.
December 31st, 2008 at 6:04 am
I vote for “not even in the same league”. Palin’s a joke. I wish with my last ounce of strength that Bush had been merely that.
December 31st, 2008 at 11:15 pm
Palin is just a logical next step on the series that Reagan started (regular guy, detached leader, not too bright) which led to Bush which led to Palin so it is very hard to make a comparison. Wormy apples, mealy apples, rotten apples - they’re all still apples. Did I mention this particular series seems to be on a steadily deteriorating arc? On November 4th the majority of the American people said “fool me once - shame on you, fool me twice - shame on me”. I know, I know, Bush got in twice. The majority of Americans are also “not too bright” but we learn eventually. Palin will never get the opportunities of a Bush precisely because of Bush. We’ve been there, done that, so to speak! I’m so relieved we’ll never get to know her “bottom game”. Her “top game” is ugly enough in spite of her good looks. Those silk purse duds could not hide that sow’s ear in the end. Time is ticking and her good looks will age and she is unlikely to get any brighter or better informed. She has her fans though and I’m one of them. She is the best joke in politics, well was before Blagojevich. Unfortunately for America and the world - Bush, his Presidency and his legacy are far too tragic to be a joke.
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Hey Yglesias, have you manned up to Palmieri yet?
You are a pussy
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